Canon EOS R6 announcement moved to July [CR2]

[joestopper]

yeah me too. I hope that if this is true, the reason for doing it is to free up resources for the R5.

I hope so too.
Speaking for it: The R5 is a technology lead/highlight. The longer it takes to get it to market the higher the chance the competitors come out with the same specs -- and leadership is gone.
Since this does not hold for R6, it makes sense to postpone that one.

 

[unfocused]

One comment about all the talk of an R6 using the same sensor as the 1Dx III. Of course we have no idea whether that will be the case or not, but even if it is, it sounds to me, from reading Canon's white paper on the 1DxIII and from reviews and samples online, most of the "magic" come from the processing in the camera. The increased low light capability seems to mostly be in Canon's treatment of jpgs. So, even if they used the exact same sensor, it is highly unlikely that an R6 would have the same sophisticated processing algorithms that are applied to the 1Dx III.

 

[slclick]

When they can is now a term for customers as well. A lot of folks can't pay rent/mortgage, the key thing is like Viktor said "...luxuries like a new camera". If you used one to put food on your table or a roof over your heads, your current gear will still do that IF you have the jobs or clients. A new one isn't changing anything. Unless you are that one guy.

 

[Mr Majestyk]

Here I sit desperately hoping I could still have an R5 in my hands by August and slowly realizing that probably won't be the case even if I get the very first preorder

Most of us will be very lucky to have one in our hands by Xmas IMO. The demand for this will be insane, and supply will struggle. I have zero expectations of getting one before 2021 and if the price is over $4KUSD, then where I live Canon will slap a $7K RRP and there will be no discounting probably until mid 2021 unless the camera fails to live upto the hype and specs.

 

[unfocused]

When they can is now a term for customers as well. A lot of folks can't pay rent/mortgage, the key thing is like Viktor said "...luxuries like a new camera". If you used one to put food on your table or a roof over your heads, your current gear will still do that IF you have the jobs or clients. A new one isn't changing anything. Unless you are that one guy.

There seems to be an interesting divide on this forum -- one that is reflected in much of the current Coronavirus impact everywhere. Not trying to make a political comment at all, but it seems like there are those who are significantly impacted by the pandemic economics -- on this forum that includes nearly everyone who uses a camera to earn a living. Then, there are many who are insulated (at least for the time being) from the financial impact. There appear to be a substantial number of enthusiasts on this forum who fit into that category.

I kind of have one foot in each world. I use my camera to earn income that supplements my retirement income. I know I am very lucky because I can pay my bills without the photography income. Although I have lost several jobs because events are not being held and I have missed the entire spring sports season at the college that I work for part time. So, I like to think that I have some sympathy for those who are mid-career and need the work to earn their living, even if I am lucky enough not to share their circumstances.

For those that are not impacted I have one comment: complaining about a few months delay in camera releases won't and shouldn't get you any sympathy.

 

[Ozarker]

When they can is now a term for customers as well. A lot of folks can't pay rent/mortgage, the key thing is like Viktor said "...luxuries like a new camera". If you used one to put food on your table or a roof over your heads, your current gear will still do that IF you have the jobs or clients. A new one isn't changing anything. Unless you are that one guy.

Things are bad. Even TFP shooters like myself are doing nothing around here in DFW. I really feel for the photographers (everyone really) who are not making their living right now. I am seeing a lot of gear, some very recently acquired, being sold on Facebook marketplace.

Not to be too pessimistic, but I think we are still at the very beginning of all this. I'll be hanging on to any money I have until I see the economic storm clouds lift for a good solid year. I think many will do the same. The recovery will be very slow for most. While there is a lens (yet to be announced or released) I'd like to have, it can wait however long it takes. I sure won't get pissed off that Canon has to delay things like I've seen some do. To me, that's just selfishness. I've got some neighbors with young children. I'd rather wait to see if they need some help.

 

[Ozarker]

For those that are not impacted I have one comment: complaining about a few months delay in camera releases won't and shouldn't get you any sympathy.

Damn straight!

 

[victorshikhman]

I know many, myself included, visit the forums as a fun distraction, and I didn't mean to bring things down. Whoever has the money to splurge on gear right now, enjoy! We need your gluttonous reckless spending to support the global economy. Just kidding! I hope everyone here stays safe and is able to enjoy all this gear for many more years in good health.

 

[fox40phil]

I m still hoping for 24MP instead of only 20MP...!

 

[Jethro]

One comment about all the talk of an R6 using the same sensor as the 1Dx III. Of course we have no idea whether that will be the case or not, but even if it is, it sounds to me, from reading Canon's white paper on the 1DxIII and from reviews and samples online, most of the "magic" come from the processing in the camera. The increased low light capability seems to mostly be in Canon's treatment of jpgs. So, even if they used the exact same sensor, it is highly unlikely that an R6 would have the same sophisticated processing algorithms that are applied to the 1Dx III.

Absolutely - and the iDX III will have multiple digics involved in that processing, as opposed to the R6's one. It may well be the same sensor, but this shows up the limited role sensors play in camera performance in 2020.

 

[davidhfe]

One comment about all the talk of an R6 using the same sensor as the 1Dx III. Of course we have no idea whether that will be the case or not, but even if it is, it sounds to me, from reading Canon's white paper on the 1DxIII and from reviews and samples online, most of the "magic" come from the processing in the camera. The increased low light capability seems to mostly be in Canon's treatment of jpgs. So, even if they used the exact same sensor, it is highly unlikely that an R6 would have the same sophisticated processing algorithms that are applied to the 1Dx III.

Absolutely - and the iDX III will have multiple digics involved in that processing, as opposed to the R6's one. It may well be the same sensor, but this shows up the limited role sensors play in camera performance in 2020.

A couple of random notes on this:
- The 1DX3 has a single Digic X, and that's basically where the camera's horsepower comes from. Seems like any additional chips are more about PDAF AF/iTR/metering, etc--that's all stuff that's DSLR specific.
- At the speeds stated for the R6, I'd be surprised if they didn't use a variant of the Digic X. My personal impression is that a lot of canon's mirrorless performance will hinge on this chip's architect. I'll grant that Digic X is probably more of a platform than a specific chip, and it might not be identical to the 1DX3, but folks--they're not going to stuff a Digic 8 in this.
- When talking about IQ, I was referring to RAW DR performance. Digic shouldn't matter here.
- If (and yea, it's a big if) they are using the same sensor, I'd expect pretty much identical images. Canon has no need to protect the IQ of the 1DX3, that's not the name of the game for that camera.

I'm going off of the rumors here, but I find it unfathomable that canon would create a second FF 20mp chip suitable for ILC cameras.

 

[slclick]

Is it strange for me to wonder that if the R6 has everything a potential customer wanted but since it only had 20 mp they would pass on it? I find that bizarre. Fallout of the megapickles war of the 00's and teens. Give me IQ and DR improvements over the 5D3 with an R5 style body and I'm in. I don't care if they manage it with 12mp.

 

[usern4cr]

Is it strange for me to wonder that if the R6 has everything a potential customer wanted but since it only had 20 mp they would pass on it? I find that bizarre. Fallout of the megapickles war of the 00's and teens. Give me IQ and DR improvements over the 5D3 with an R5 style body and I'm in. I don't care if they manage it with 12mp.

I would also say that if a new R6 camera has everything a customer wanted, plus a big shiny full frame sensor that just happened to have 20MP, *and* be at a competitive price they could afford, they would be *very* happy with it. I'm assuming that they also get a good lens to go with it, also at a price they can afford. The quality of a camera like that is so far ahead of what they would have been using that they should be elated.

Now, with that said, which lens should be in the kit that is offered for them to buy, and what price should that whole kit cost?

 

[Ozarker]

Now, with that said, which lens should be in the kit that is offered for them to buy, and what price should that whole kit cost?

An RF 35mm f/1.8 or RF 50mm f/1.8 or a 50-250mm zoom.

 

[slclick]

I would also say that if a new R6 camera has everything a customer wanted, plus a big shiny full frame sensor that just happened to have 20MP, *and* be at a competitive price they could afford, they would be *very* happy with it. I'm assuming that they also get a good lens to go with it, also at a price they can afford. The quality of a camera like that is so far ahead of what they would have been using that they should be elated.

Now, with that said, which lens should be in the kit that is offered for them to buy, and what price should that whole kit cost?

I really don't see what any glass has to do with the equation/my post. You're making it into a price thing. I'm talking about image quality potential and to some extent, ergonomics.

 

[SecureGSM]

I think the 200D has some electronic inside its grip, maybe (for shure!) with some fibre optic data connection. The grip gets warm during video compared to e.g. M50s back side (around sensor location) - maybe its only a voltage converter but heat is heat and slightly warmer sensors are always better than hot sensors.
And 200D has slightly cleaner IQ compared to the M50 while sharing similar sensors - not measured, just oberved.

The grip gets warmer due to batteries inside the grip drawing more current in the video mode or continuous shooting. There is no electronics inside the grip... and there is no any other processor / logic there. Bottleneck for an off-chip processing is the bus (speed) and ability to multi-Processor and multitask.
in a few words. Highly unlikely at this time.

 

[SecureGSM]

One comment about all the talk of an R6 using the same sensor as the 1Dx III. Of course we have no idea whether that will be the case or not, but even if it is, it sounds to me, from reading Canon's white paper on the 1DxIII and from reviews and samples online, most of the "magic" come from the processing in the camera. The increased low light capability seems to mostly be in Canon's treatment of jpgs. So, even if they used the exact same sensor, it is highly unlikely that an R6 would have the same sophisticated processing algorithms that are applied to the 1Dx III.

A much faster sensor readout speed is what was missing in R and RP. Hence a laggy EVF and lethargic continuous speed and tracking.
1DxIII sensor readout speed seems was greatly improved. So.... commercially, I seen no reason why it cannot be re used in R6. Definitely makes perfect sense to me. However , Canon would likely Claim a “new” sensor was used. Tongue in cheek kinda...

 

[Bahrd]

Low light performance does not have to be inherently dependent on MP, rather it's dependent on total sensor size and quantum efficiency & well depth.

If a "low light performance" refers to "a photon deficit" case, why is a well depth a factor?

 

[scottkinfw]

I'm wondering if there is an R5 surprise that allows Canon to sell it at a 5D price point yet still get the bigger dollars for the 8K functionality.

I still think it's a $3499 body, but I would not be shocked at all if there was a one-time service center trip + nasty fee or expensive external bolt-on required to get 8K working. But I haven't obsessed over each wave of announcements -- I don't know if Canon has already stated if that will / will not be the case.

- A

Good thought. On the positive side, who needs 8K right now? I would prefer the additional 20=/- res of the R5 and in the future, if needed, would gladly send the camera in for servicing and upgrade to 8K.

 

[scottkinfw]

I'm surprised all new camera/lens announcements were not suspended a month ago. If broader retail sales are any indication, everyone in the camera business just got clobbered the last two months, even more than they already were with falling sales, with more pain coming. Releasing new products into this environment is madness.

OTOH, there are some people (like me) who naturally are on the upgrade cycle and have saved for just a Sanon camera just like this. I can't be alone in this. The big question is how many people are comfortable enough to pull the trigger. Time will tell.