The Canon EOS R5 Mark II will continue with CFexpress Type B/SD UHS-II card slots

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#101
EvilTed said:
Speed of clearing the buffer.
There R5 has a notoriously bad buffer and will get to the point where it will pause shooting until it clears.
Buffer clearing is a function of the slowest card type used.

There are some good articles on the fastest buffer clearing rates on the R3 using mixed vs. single cards and single CFE B is by far the fastest.
If the R5 II is giving 30 FPS and they haven't improved the buffer then this is a deal breaker for anyone shooting sports or wildlife.
Or you just have to shoot with a single CFE B card.
Click to expand...
The Digital Picture did some testing of the buffer clearance for R5/R6 a couple of years ago and didn't show a "notoriously bad buffer".
20fps CFe raw + SD raw = >5 seconds of shooting/104 shots vs CFe @ 33 seconds
12fps CFe raw + SD raw = ~15 seconds/175 shots vs Cfe @ 7 seconds
https://www.the-digital-picture.com...-R6-Buffer-Capacity-During-High-Speed-Capture

Are you using slower cards - especially for the UHS-ii cards? There are a couple of sites that test them and currently the Sony Tough is the fastest.
It looks like the shooting speed is 3fps after the buffer is hit (EFV blackout/AF tracking an issue) using a Sony Tough 64GB SD card
https://rfshooters.com/blog/cameras/canon-r5/memory-cards/

It is hard to believe that the R5 is currently a deal breaker for anyone shooting sports or wildlife!
 
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#102
David - Sydney said:
The Digital Picture did some testing of the buffer clearance for R5/R6 a couple of years ago and didn't show a "notoriously bad buffer".
20fps CFe raw + SD raw = >5 seconds of shooting/104 shots vs CFe @ 33 seconds
12fps CFe raw + SD raw = ~15 seconds/175 shots vs Cfe @ 7 seconds
https://www.the-digital-picture.com...-R6-Buffer-Capacity-During-High-Speed-Capture

Are you using slower cards - especially for the UHS-ii cards? There are a couple of sites that test them and currently the Sony Tough is the fastest.
It looks like the shooting speed is 3fps after the buffer is hit (EFV blackout/AF tracking an issue) using a Sony Tough 64GB SD card
https://rfshooters.com/blog/cameras/canon-r5/memory-cards/

It is hard to believe that the R5 is currently a deal breaker for anyone shooting sports or wildlife!
Click to expand...
It’s not so much the speed, but the behaviour when the buffer is full. Nikon drops down to a consistent, lower fps that matches the card write speed. Canon will just stop taking picture for multiple seconds, then do a full speed burst, then stop for multiple seconds, burst, stop….

The work around is to never let the buffer fill, so lift your finger from the shutter every second. You’ll miss some action, but you won’t get locked out for long periods.
 
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#104
EOS 4 Life said:
CF Express Type B cards are faster than fast SD cards.
Click to expand...
I know. Otherwise, the 4 to 10 times higher prices would be ridiculous.
Of course, you can get slower SD cards for cheaper, but then you are not getting the full benefit of the cameras above the R50.
Click to expand...
Maybe you can read my post again, where I stated that SD cards are not the speed limiting factor for me with my R6m2.
Esp. for vid people it could/will.

So I don't get the point of your reply.
 
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#106
Maximilian said:
I know. Otherwise, the 4 to 10 times higher prices would be ridiculous.[...]
Click to expand...
My definition of 'fast' is V90 and >250MB/s speeds, those SD cards are the same price or more expensive than CFe cards of the same capacity. For example a Prograde CFe Gold v4 (not the older v2) 256GB card is $170, their 256GB V90 SD card is $184. If we look at the Ultra range from OWC, the 512GB SD card is more expensive than the 1TB CFe v4 card, $500 vs $350!

That wasn't the case when the R5 launched, I used a 128GB CFe card for stills and a 256GB SD card for video. 8k video is huuuuuuge, but it is great for macro, I loose a lot of the frame to get the shake out of the video, but can still get 4k-ish resolution in the end result. Or get 8k and motion sickness as a bonus :)

It looks like it would be cheaper to get a huge CFe card for the R5II and record both stills and video to CFe and use the SD card purely for overflow.
 
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#108
David - Sydney said:
The Digital Picture did some testing of the buffer clearance for R5/R6 a couple of years ago and didn't show a "notoriously bad buffer".
20fps CFe raw + SD raw = >5 seconds of shooting/104 shots vs CFe @ 33 seconds
12fps CFe raw + SD raw = ~15 seconds/175 shots vs Cfe @ 7 seconds
https://www.the-digital-picture.com...-R6-Buffer-Capacity-During-High-Speed-Capture

Are you using slower cards - especially for the UHS-ii cards? There are a couple of sites that test them and currently the Sony Tough is the fastest.
It looks like the shooting speed is 3fps after the buffer is hit (EFV blackout/AF tracking an issue) using a Sony Tough 64GB SD card
https://rfshooters.com/blog/cameras/canon-r5/memory-cards/

It is hard to believe that the R5 is currently a deal breaker for anyone shooting sports or wildlife!
Click to expand...
There's Jan Wegener on YouTube who shoots wildlife and in his review of the Nikon Z6 III mentioned the Canon R5 buffer clearing problem.
I shot sports and events with 2x Nikon D5s with dual CFE Bs - no problem. I shot sports and events with 2x Canon R5s - major lockups as buffer cleared. Now I shoot sports and events with 2x R3s which works fine at 30 FPS if I use CRAW to the CFEB and JPG regular to the fastest UHS-II.
Having shot with dual CFE Bs I would prefer this in all my cameras. CFE Bs are actually cheaper than the highest end UHS-II cards these days.
 
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#109
koenkooi said:
It’s not so much the speed, but the behaviour when the buffer is full. Nikon drops down to a consistent, lower fps that matches the card write speed. Canon will just stop taking picture for multiple seconds, then do a full speed burst, then stop for multiple seconds, burst, stop….

The work around is to never let the buffer fill, so lift your finger from the shutter every second. You’ll miss some action, but you won’t get locked out for long periods.
Click to expand...
rfshooters.com

Best Canon R5 Memory Cards With Speed & Buffer Tests - RF Shooters

We test over 30 memory cards in the Canon R5 to find out which CFexpress and SD cards are the fastest in-camera.
rfshooters.com rfshooters.com

CRAW + JPEG L is the combination I end up using with R5s and R3s.
 
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#110
Tirmite said:
The sky is falling!!!! Or MAYBE having two DIFFERENT slots and card types makes a LOT of sense.
1) laptops and computers have SD readers built in. At least Macs do. Not sure why anyone who's a photographer would use a Windows machine but that's their choice.
2) heat and space issues in the camera body.
3) price: SD's are less expensive
4) speed: I buy the fast SD's and they read and write very fast. And when archiving to SSD drives versus hard drives it's even faster. If someone really needs more speed, guess what.... the second slot is an Express. Duh.
5) If you need an external card reader, the SD readers are small and inexpensive so they take up less room in your bag. The Apple SD dongle is tiny.
6) have you ever had to give your client the shots on the spot? Oops, they don't have a card reader or computer with a slot. I'd much rather hand over a less expensive SD card and not worry if I get it back or not. Try that with a $200 Express card.
7) ever been in a foreign country where a police or other law enforcement officer demands you hand over your memory card? I have. Again, I'd rather give them an inexpensive SD and then I still have everything written to the Express card and they probably don't realize the camera has two cards.
*If you haven't experienced any of the above or even considered these possibilities you probably aren't a professional photographer or haven't had much experience.
Canon and it's engineers aren't idiots. They also know their customers and what PRO's want in a camera. That's why the R5 and the R3 have both kinds of slots. We pros want that feature. You're entitled to your own opinions, but just because there are other, better ideas out there doesn't mean Canon made a mistake.
Click to expand...
Yep. this is the correct answer with obviously real professional experience =) I couldn't agree more =)
 
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#111
koenkooi said:
My definition of 'fast' is V90 and >250MB/s speeds, those SD cards are the same price or more expensive than CFe cards of the same capacity.
Click to expand...
Okay. There You've got me.
I am working with V20 V30 (200MB/s instead of 300/s). Still fast enough for me, as I don't shoot long buffer series.
Sandisk Extreme pro V30 128 MB: 21,-€
Sandisk Extreme pro V90 128 MB: 130,-€
Sandisk Extreme pro CFexpress 128 MB: 105,-€
 
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#112
Maximilian said:
Okay. There You've got me.
I am working with V20 (200MB/s instead of 300/s). Still fast enough for me, as I don't shoot long buffer series.
Sandisk Extreme pro V30 128 MB: 21,-€
Sandisk Extreme pro V90 128 MB: 130,-€
Sandisk Extreme pro CFexpress 128 MB: 105,-€
Click to expand...
v20 would be twenty, not two-hundred MB/s. The number is the guaranteed write speed and since it’s a consumer video thing, it only goes up to 90mbyte/s.
So anything between the ‘v90’ and ‘299’ printed on the label isn’t guaranteed :)
 
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#114
Tirmite said:
The sky is falling!!!! Or MAYBE having two DIFFERENT slots and card types makes a LOT of sense.
1) laptops and computers have SD readers built in. At least Macs do. Not sure why anyone who's a photographer would use a Windows machine but that's their choice.
2) heat and space issues in the camera body.
3) price: SD's are less expensive
4) speed: I buy the fast SD's and they read and write very fast. And when archiving to SSD drives versus hard drives it's even faster. If someone really needs more speed, guess what.... the second slot is an Express. Duh.
5) If you need an external card reader, the SD readers are small and inexpensive so they take up less room in your bag. The Apple SD dongle is tiny.
6) have you ever had to give your client the shots on the spot? Oops, they don't have a card reader or computer with a slot. I'd much rather hand over a less expensive SD card and not worry if I get it back or not. Try that with a $200 Express card.
7) ever been in a foreign country where a police or other law enforcement officer demands you hand over your memory card? I have. Again, I'd rather give them an inexpensive SD and then I still have everything written to the Express card and they probably don't realize the camera has two cards.
*If you haven't experienced any of the above or even considered these possibilities you probably aren't a professional photographer or haven't had much experience.
Canon and it's engineers aren't idiots. They also know their customers and what PRO's want in a camera. That's why the R5 and the R3 have both kinds of slots. We pros want that feature. You're entitled to your own opinions, but just because there are other, better ideas out there doesn't mean Canon made a mistake.
Click to expand...

Jeff Cable's Blog

Jeff Cable Photography Blog - Featuring photos from the Olympics, local events and everything in between.
blog.jeffcable.com blog.jeffcable.com

He seems to agree with me that having mixed CF B and SD cards on cameras shooting sports is a bad idea?
Jeff is shooting the Olympics next week. How about you?
It's bad enough that you fail to grasp this, but you insist on qualifying your patronizing posts with the "pro" tag.
It's physics pure and simple. If you don't understand this then maybe you're not doing anything "professionally" that warrants the need for fast buffer clearing?
 
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#115
EvilTed said:
He seems to agree with me that having mixed CF B and SD cards on cameras shooting sports is a bad idea?
Jeff is shooting the Olympics next week. How about you?
It's bad enough that you fail to grasp this, but you insist on qualifying your patronizing posts with the "pro" tag.
It's physics pure and simple. If you don't understand this then maybe you're not doing anything "professionally" that warrants the need for fast buffer clearing?
Click to expand...
What's wrong with using the R1 for shooting the Olympics professionally?
 
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