The state of third-party lenses for the RF mount, Canon may be involved

I would be happy with 100-400 if it would have a good sharpness across the frame. From what I've seen so far in tests it differs from 100-500 like night and day.
So a lens costing $2900 is sharper than a lens costing $550. I'm shocked. Simply shocked. I get that many people want L-series performance at inexpensive prices. As me ol' Irish Da said, wish in one hand and sh!t in the other, and see which fills up first.
 
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I would be happy with 100-400 if it would have a good sharpness across the frame. From what I've seen so far in tests it differs from 100-500 like night and day.
I regularly use both the RF 100-500mm and (2 copies of) the RF 100-400mm on my R5 and R7 and can tell you first hand that they do not differ like "night and day". The RF 100-500mm is better, but the RF 100-400mm is damn good and pretty close to the EF 100-400mm II. There is a thread here on it: https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/threads/canon-rf-100-400mm-f-5-6-8-is-usm-first-impressions.40938/ Also look at these shots of Dragonflies in Flight: https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/threads/dragonflies-and-damselflies.35543/page-77#post-940673

I really wish people wouldn't propagate judgments on what they haven't seen first hand. (ps, look at the measured sharpness across the field from 200-400mm https://www.ephotozine.com/article/canon-rf-100-400mm-f-5-6-8-is-usm-lens-review-36026/performance )
 
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Maybe I am being too generous toward Canon, but I have to believe that some part of this is not just a money grab but a quality control thing—they don't want bad lenses making their cameras look bad. However, this is a solved problem: 3rd party lens makers ought to be able to have Canon 'certify' whatever they want to release for the RF mount. Call it 'Made for Canon' or something like that. They should be able to certify (and collect royalties) on the sale of 3rd party lenses. Would this mean that a Sigma lens will be more expensive on RF than on E-mount? Yes, but for the most part Canon's lenses are already higher in price than the competition, so... ‍¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I just really want to buy some Sigma primes for my Canon, and not have to adapt the EF versions.
 
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I would be happy with 100-400 if it would have a good sharpness across the frame. From what I've seen so far in tests it differs from 100-500 like night and day. Sigma on the other hand is not. Sigma starts to struggle on 400mm. I seriously was considered to buy sigma for EF mount, but unfortunately it has focus issues when you're adapting it to rf mount.

On youtube you would find a review for 24mm 1.8. It has god awful coma and this is deal breaker for me. Again I can adapt any other EF lens, yes. But I'm new to the system and the rf mount is fresh as well. I can wait for a proper lens and I did. 24 1.8 not worth the money. With no 3rd party I'm no longer considering to invest in RF mount.
I have had no focus issues with the Sigma 100-400 on the R5 and R7 personally.
 
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For the particular lens you are after options exist on L and E mounts from Sigma in the form of the newly released 20mm f1.4 and 24mm f1.4 DG DNs. Canon may make lenses in that category but they haven’t yet and they would cost a lot more while not necessarily being a lot better.
According to TDP, the 24mm Sigma is absolutely comatose! TDP hasn't tested the 20mm yet, so to recommend it is risky at least, unless you rely on Youtube reviews or DPReview...which I certainly wouldn't
 
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According to TDP, the 24mm Sigma is absolutely comatose! TDP hasn't tested the 20mm yet, so to recommend it is risky at least, unless you rely on Youtube reviews or DPReview...which I certainly wouldn't
According to TDP, the 24mm Sigma is absolutely comatose! TDP hasn't tested the 20mm yet, so to recommend it is risky at least, unless you rely on Youtube reviews or DPReview...which I certainly wouldn't
The reviews of both the 24mm and 20mm have been largely positive. The 20mm seems to be the better of the 2 from the reviews I have seen.

What do you mean by comatose and which site is TDP?
 
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I would be happy with 100-400 if it would have a good sharpness across the frame. From what I've seen so far in tests it differs from 100-500 like night and day. Sigma on the other hand is not. Sigma starts to struggle on 400mm. I seriously was considered to buy sigma for EF mount, but unfortunately it has focus issues when you're adapting it to rf mount.

On youtube you would find a review for 24mm 1.8. It has god awful coma and this is deal breaker for me. Again I can adapt any other EF lens, yes. But I'm new to the system and the rf mount is fresh as well. I can wait for a proper lens and I did. 24 1.8 not worth the money. With no 3rd party I'm no longer considering to invest in RF mount.
Before buying, read the TDP reviews, they are among the serious ones.
The Sigma 24 F1,4 DG has horrible coma, for instance!
 
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A: lots of coma
B: The Digital Picture (one of the few serious review sites)
Yes it has some coma, it mentions in the digital picture review that while he hoped for better coma performance it wasn’t unusual for that class of lens. What level of coma that is acceptable is for individuals to decide for themselves. If someone wants a better lens for coma performance that means getting the 24mm f1.4 GM which is quite a bit more expensive. Nice to have the choice though.
 
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There is no law against reverse engineering. If the 3rd parties are infringing on patents then that is a different story.
That's a fair point. Hopefully this is just Viltrox being sloppy and infringing on something they should not have. Hopefully we will see reverse engineered Sigma, Tamron, Tokina lenses. But this hits home because Sony will license their mount to you and has a rapidly growing 3rd party catalog, while RF is a desert of 3rd party options.

"certain number of users" is the key issue. Given Canon's dominance and ongoing profitability for their shareholders, I don't see them being worried about a few users that they lose vs the potential new EF/RF lenses that they can sell.

It's not going to be "a few users." And you don't have to lose much more than a few for the lost body/lens sales, marketshare, and word-of-mouth to exceed the profits captured on the other end. See dlee13's post for a real life example. Canon lost body and lens sales. People will now see him shooting Sony. When they ask his opinion, he will recommend Sony 'because of the 3rd party lens options.' Those people will go on to buy Sony.

Canon would be wise to just license the mount.
 
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Yes it has some coma, it mentions in the digital picture review that while he hoped for better coma performance it wasn’t unusual for that class of lens. What level of coma that is acceptable is for individuals to decide for themselves. If someone wants a better lens for coma performance that means getting the 24mm f1.4 GM which is quite a bit more expensive. Nice to have the choice though.
I'll just wait for the Canon RF version...
 
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That's a fair point. Hopefully this is just Viltrox being sloppy and infringing on something they should not have. Hopefully we will see reverse engineered Sigma, Tamron, Tokina lenses. But this hits home because Sony will license their mount to you and has a rapidly growing 3rd party catalog, while RF is a desert of 3rd party options.



It's not going to be "a few users." And you don't have to lose much more than a few for the lost body/lens sales, marketshare, and word-of-mouth to exceed the profits captured on the other end. See dlee13's post for a real life example. Canon lost body and lens sales. People will now see him shooting Sony. When they ask his opinion, he will recommend Sony 'because of the 3rd party lens options.' Those people will go on to buy Sony.

Canon would be wise to just license the mount.
Back in June a Sigma UK rep told me that they are waiting on licenses from both Canon and Nikon so that they can release lenses on those platforms. Recent events point to that not only being a good move but also potentially mandatory. Sigma, Tamron and Cosina will know what has happened to Samyang, Viltrox and Yongnuo and have no doubt already researched if reverse engineering is possible from a technical standpoint to which the answer is almost certainly yes but then might have already discovered or been told by outright by Canon that legally it’s prohibited.
 
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It's not going to be "a few users." And you don't have to lose much more than a few for the lost body/lens sales, marketshare, and word-of-mouth to exceed the profits captured on the other end. See dlee13's post for a real life example. Canon lost body and lens sales. People will now see him shooting Sony. When they ask his opinion, he will recommend Sony 'because of the 3rd party lens options.' Those people will go on to buy Sony.

Canon would be wise to just license the mount.
You should really tell Canon. Be sure to mention that one person switched over this issue, like an iceberg that is 90% underwater, there must be at least 9 more people switching over this travesty. Maybe they've never even considered licensing their mounts.

You and others on this forum know so much more about the camera business than the company that's dominated it for >20 years, it's really a shame that none of you seem willing to just tell Canon what they've been doing wrong all these years and exactly how to fix it. Speak up, man. The fate of the photography industry and thousands of jobs are all down to you!
 
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It's not going to be "a few users." And you don't have to lose much more than a few for the lost body/lens sales, marketshare, and word-of-mouth to exceed the profits captured on the other end. See dlee13's post for a real life example. Canon lost body and lens sales. People will now see him shooting Sony. When they ask his opinion, he will recommend Sony 'because of the 3rd party lens options.' Those people will go on to buy Sony.

Canon would be wise to just license the mount.
Wisdom is seen in hindsight but I don't think that it is correct today. Canon is more likely to lose long term by licensing the mount now than keeping it proprietary and forcing 3rd party lens manufacturers to use their reverse engineered EF mount. For all we know, Canon may currently be actively selling a license but at a cost that the 3rd parties are not willing to buy at.

I get that users would prefer a native mount but that simply isn't possible for all lens niches. I don't get the concerns against adapting EF. The standout for me is that the EF40mm pancake doubles in size etc when adapted whereas a RF version should be svelte if more expensive.

There will always be some differences between lens ecosystems that may mean switchers but it is expensive to switch and learn a new system. Canon has a lot of unique lenses in EF/RF that would prompt switchers the other way... net adds is the key metric here.
 
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