Worst of Canon 2023: It’s Unanimous

[SteveC]

LOLOLOLOL Nice one.

The market decisions defenders are the worst. We got a couple famous ones in these forums, and on dpreview also, its the same dudes over and over again.

"you may think it sucks, and its missing features, but canon knows best"

=
Corpo huggers
Missing the point
Dont actually understand the category of the criticism
just dont get it

Happy forums 2024!

And the way to avoid triggering them is to say something like "I wish Canon had done X" rather than "Canon didn't do X so this is a piece of junk that won't sell" or "Canon needs to do X"

 

[EricN]

And the way to avoid triggering them is to say something like "I wish Canon had done X" rather than "Canon didn't do X so this is a piece of junk that won't sell" or "Canon needs to do X"

There is a huge difference in those statements.

 

[neuroanatomist]

LOLOLOLOL Nice one.

The market decisions defenders are the worst. We got a couple famous ones in these forums, and on dpreview also, its the same dudes over and over again.

"you may think it sucks, and its missing features, but canon knows best"

=
Corpo huggers
Missing the point
Dont actually understand the category of the criticism
just dont get it

Happy forums 2024!

Yeah, and we got a couple of famous Canon is doomed ones, too.

“Doesn’t matter if millions of people buy it, it’s total crap and unusable for anything”

=
Incessant whiners
Think their opinion is universal
Don’t actually understand they don’t represent the market
just don’t get it

Happy New Year.

SOIDY (same old idiots, different year)

 

[EricN]

Canon could sell a literal piece of horseshit and some people here would defend them.

Never forget the likes of Nokia or RIM when proclaiming that the market leader knows best - as it turns out, sometimes they don't.

I can't remember anyone defending Canon's decisions regarding RF teleconverters and non-useability on 70-200 or limited useability on 100-500.

 

[John Wilde]

Never forget the likes of Nokia or RIM when proclaiming that the market leader knows best - as it turns out, sometimes they don't.

If the R100 turns out to be a sales flop, it won't have much impact on Canon. After looking that the R100, people can buy the R50 instead. Canon forecasts that they will sell 2.9 million interchangeable lens cameras this year, for a market share of (2.9/5.85) almost 50%. They forecast that their camera-only revenue will be +8.2% compared to last year. They release their 2023 as a whole numbers on January 30.

 

[neuroanatomist]

Canon could sell a literal piece of horseshit and some people here would defend them.

That seems rather unlikely, even as hyperbole. On the other hand, consider that what this forum labeled the worst product of the year is actually selling very well. What does that say about who knows the market better?

Never forget the likes of Nokia or RIM when proclaiming that the market leader knows best - as it turns out, sometimes they don't.

Thousands of successful large companies in the world, you’re right, we should never forget those two. They represent a minuscule, irrelevant fraction of companies in existence. I bet you use a stopped analog clock as an example of a timepiece…after all, it’s right for one out of every 720 minutes.

Edit: OMG, you forgot Kodak!!!

 

[neuroanatomist]

If the R100 turns out to be a sales flop, it won't have much impact on Canon. After looking that the R100, people can buy the R50 instead. Canon forecasts that they will sell 2.9 million interchangeable lens cameras this year, for a market share of (2.9/5.85) almost 50%. They forecast that their camera-only revenue will be +8.2% compared to last year. They release their 2023 as a whole numbers on January 30.

Thanks, it would be great if some people here actually cared about facts and data. Sadly, their own opinions ring far too loudly in their ears for such information to have any impact.

 

[neuroanatomist]

I can't remember anyone defending Canon's decisions regarding RF teleconverters and non-useability on 70-200 or limited useability on 100-500.

I’d do so on the former, assuming the compact retraced size precludes extender compatibility. Sure, I’d prefer both but if a choice is forced I’d pick the smaller size over extender use.

 

[DhlcadR6]

Keep in mind that they compare 61 MP vs 45 MP.

R5's 45MP CMOS has "thicker" AA filter than R6ii/R8. So TDP is doing their best to give non-Canon advantage

Good call. It's a piece of trash no one should buy

That said, RFS (mount) and the 24-50 slow trash heap gets special mention.

RFS is STILL the worst crop mount available to consumer. And its all canons fault. 4 bodies, and an army of bottom barrel lenses. Yes, there is hope, but we're talking about 2023..

and it SUCKS what canon is doing to their crop customers.

RF-S isn't an independent mount. Just an indicator of the lens is a crop lens. What's wrong for not using full frame RF lenses on those APS-C bodies.

24-50 is cheap enough to ignore the "defects".

Canon's APS-C RF cameras are the only ones other than Fuji has full coverage on 10-400mm(16mm~640mm FF equv.), and the only one that achieves this for cheap. Having the complete focal range covered is better than bright f-stops

 

[EricN]

Since 2010 total camera sales have decreased from 121 million units to about 8 million, while ILCs have decreased by around 60% in the same time. If you can't see the parallels you are willfully ignorant.

Canon might be the market leader, but they have suffered significantly, just like all the other camera manufacturers. But I am sure that in their infinite wisdom this was part of some grand scheme and not the fact that their entire imaging industry is being bulldozed by new players on the market.

Source: https://www.statista.com/topics/3884/cameras/#topicOverview


Oh how I wish you would see the irony of you yourself posting this.

As for the rest of your condescending ad-hominem replies I won't even bother responding to them, as everyone using this forum is well aware of your arrogant tone at this point.

You're doing the same thing without the humor....

 

[blackcoffee17]

RF-S isn't an independent mount. Just an indicator of the lens is a crop lens. What's wrong for not using full frame RF lenses on those APS-C bodies.

24-50 is cheap enough to ignore the "defects".

The wrong part is the lack of good quality bight-ish standard zoom. We only have barrel-bottom dark/cheap plastic zooms, unless you want to adapt the expensive 15-35 or 14-35 and those are limited in focal length.

The 24-50 is not cheap enough to ignore defects when the similar Nikon Z lens is much better optically.

 

[koenkooi]

The wrong part is the lack of good quality bight-ish standard zoom. We only have barrel-bottom dark/cheap plastic zooms, unless you want to adapt the expensive 15-35 or 14-35 and those are limited in focal length.

The 24-50 is not cheap enough to ignore defects when the similar Nikon Z lens is much better optically.

Something like the Sigma 10-18 f/2.8 would be awesome for RF.

 

[David - Sydney]

Tbh my main one supports wireless charging (it's a bit slow though).

Wireless charging is inherently inefficient unfortunately but it is simple. A powerbank with built in usbc and lightning cable is as good ymmv.

 

[David - Sydney]

I had a CDMA phone up until a couple of years ago and finally had to switch it to a 4G phone. The coverage of the 4G phone is substantially poorer than CDMA was, which makes sense, since they keep pushing the modulation levels, but it is still annoying.

The higher the frequency the less coverage but data speeds are higher as well. Frequency hopping and other options for less interference are in later generations. The original generations weren’t well encrypted so there were some interesting recordings

 

[AlanF]

Wireless charging is inherently inefficient unfortunately but it is simple. A powerbank with built in usbc and lightning cable is as good ymmv.

Lightning cables are now passé thanks to the EU! Wireless charging is indeed only about 70% efficient. I use plug in for charging but when out and about and there is a chance power might run out, it is more convenient to magsafe a wireless charger to the back of the iPhone and continue to hold the phone for calls or general use. There are some very nice little USB_C chargers like the Anker Nano Bank but I suppose it's not as robustly attached as by the magnets in the magsafe.

 

[AlanF]

I’d do so on the former, assuming the compact retraced size precludes extender compatibility. Sure, I’d prefer both but if a choice is forced I’d pick the smaller size over extender use.

I've now spent several days testing 3 different copies of the RF 1.4x on the RF 100-500 as I thought my original was a poor copy, but they are all as bad as each other. Bryan's results on TDP are similar. On the other hand, the 1.4x looks good on your RF 100-300mm in his charts. Theoretically, extenders are best on wider lenses and for sensors with larger pixels because of diffraction so we shouldn't expect much of them on the narrower lenses.

 

[David - Sydney]

I say its 3Rd party lenses support that Canon does not want to allow. So, as a whole i vote with my wallet and will not buy anything Canon makes in protest. Keep in mind that I am ... scratch that ... WAS using Canon when everyone around me was using Nikon back when AE1 was still somewhat new camera. After decades of being loyal Canon customer, this has broken Camels back for me.

Thanks for letting us know that you don’t use and won’t use canon…. why are you here in the forum??

 

[David - Sydney]

Lightning cables are now passé thanks to the EU!

Finally but there are still lots of currently used iPhones and other devices - even dual MagSafe wireless/I watch chargers.
Usbc cables aren’t labelled so some handle different charging rates and data speeds which is very annoying :-(

 

[David - Sydney]

LOLOLOLOL Nice one.

The market decisions defenders are the worst. We got a couple famous ones in these forums, and on dpreview also, its the same dudes over and over again.

"you may think it sucks, and its missing features, but canon knows best"

=
Corpo huggers
Missing the point
Dont actually understand the category of the criticism
just dont get it

Happy forums 2024!

My comment was more to the OP rather than canon. Canon doesn’t care about reviews as long as it sells for a good profit…. A commercial rather than technical success. We won’t have access to that level of data unfortunately. I believe that a touchscreen in lieu of evf would have been a better option but a comment that it wouldn’t be perceived as a real camera resonates too.

If everyone only read/watched the reviews on the R5 when it was launched would never have bought an overheating camera.

 

[neuroanatomist]

Since 2010 total camera sales have decreased from 121 million units to about 8 million, while ILCs have decreased by around 60% in the same time. If you can't see the parallels you are willfully ignorant.

Canon might be the market leader, but they have suffered significantly, just like all the other camera manufacturers. But I am sure that in their infinite wisdom this was part of some grand scheme and not the fact that their entire imaging industry is being bulldozed by new players on the market.

Source: https://www.statista.com/topics/3884/cameras/#topicOverview


Oh how I wish you would see the irony of you yourself posting this.

As for the rest of your condescending ad-hominem replies I won't even bother responding to them, as everyone using this forum is well aware of your arrogant tone at this point.

It’s cute that you can copy and paste numbers from the internet. It would be better if you could actually think critically about what the data mean, and put them in context.

Since you apparently lack either the willingness or ability (or both) to do so, I’m not going to waste my time trying to explain. I expect it would go about as well as the time I tried to teach a pig to sing (at least it would be less muddy).

But you might consider the value of cameras rather than just the unit numbers, the fact that Canon placed more emphasis on ILCs early (they barely led the camera market in 2010, by 2% at a time when no one had >20% share), but they solidly led the ILC market).

More broadly, you might consider the fraction of company revenue that cameras represent for Canon, compared to phones for Nokia and RIM. You might also have a look at stock prices, to get a sense of how the people who stake their livelihood on corporate performance view the prospects (hint: Nokia and RIM plummeted as smartphones and Apple took over from flip phones and tiny fruit, Canon followed the broader market trend as camera unit sales plummeted).

Or you can just pat yourself on the back for your ability to read a couple of numbers on the Internet. After all, why bother thinking about something critically when you can just believe your own opinion. Willful ignorance, at its finest.