Is Scotch tape the answer to your Canon EOS R5 overheating issues?

[YuengLinger]

Question: Which upsets video-first customers more, the time limit imposed by overheating, or the aggressively long cool down times?

If it's the cool-down times, and they are unnecessarily long, overly cautious, surely that is something Canon could fix with a firmware update. (BUT Canon would have to convince customers that the new times won't shorten the life of the camera or harm it in other ways.)

 

[DBounce]

so, damaged files still there? can you try to stop record and pull the battery after that, i guess not gonna work, i guess the overheating timer not gonna reset

If you stop recording the cripple timer it’s saved.

 

[DBounce]

Question: Which upsets video-first customers more, the time limit imposed by overheating, or the aggressively long cool down times?

If it's the cool-down times, and they are unnecessarily long, overly cautious, surely that is something Canon could fix with a firmware update. (BUT Canon would have to convince customers that the new times won't shorten the life of the camera or harm it in other ways.)

Actual cool down time is two minutes. In use the camera never exceeds 64C, which is well within the safety limits of the camera. To understand better it might help to know that Canon enables unlimited 4K HQ if recorded externally. I regularly run my R5 for hours at a time continuously outputting 4K HQ. The camera heats up to normal operating temperature of 64C and stays there the entire time. Please understand image quality remains consistent. There is no image degradation at these temps as some have suggested. And to make a point, this usage is approved by Canon, but strangely, running at the exact same temperature when recording internally... in the exact same mode, is somehow cause for a thermal feature lockout?
Worst still, in reality it only takes 2 minutes for the camera to cool back down to 30C. Literally, just 2 minutes... yet Canon disable these features for 2/hrs plus.
This is clearly deliberate and unfair to customers. The extremely long lockout times are mentioned nowhere in the R5 manual. There is no mention of this on the official website. To this day Canon have not spoken to this matter.

Key points:

• Unlimited recording is permissible at 64C if recording externally. But yet, at the exact same temperature, if recording internally you are artificially limited to 20 minutes.
• Actual internal cool down time is only two minutes. But Canon has chosen to disable all headline video features for 2/hrs plus. Despite the fact that the camera at no point ever reaches unsafe temperatures.

 

[Stu_bert]

should someone need 8K video, let them get a VIEOD camera

Then why offer it in the r5? And why can’t I record 5 min clips in 8k for my enjoyment without having to buy a dedicated video camera ?

 

[SecureGSM]

I'm not prepared to risk my R5, and it wouldn't surprise me if Canon had a way of knowing. Or if not, they sure will with the next firmware release. I tried the different cards approach (3 UHS II) - made no difference. I'm impressed one guy in the states I believe, is happy to put his R5 in a ziplock bag in the fridge, another guy did the same in a freezer. Not for me.

But will it blend?

 

[privatebydesign]

Then why offer it in the r5? And why can’t I record 5 min clips in 8k for my enjoyment without having to buy a dedicated video camera ?

because it can do it.

Because the processing power needed to do that creates heat Canon engineers figured might make the camera less reliable over time.

Personally there is no question in my mind I'll take limited functionality as a trade for reliability 100% of the time.

As for your personal 8k clips, do you have an 8k tv to view them on yet? If you do then worrying about any of this is purely for arguments sake and not a genuine concern.

 

[Baron_Karza]

should someone need 8K video, let them get a VIEOD camera

instead of ever getting an R5?

 

[BeenThere]

Dude you are missing the point... R5 was supposedly a camera with "pro video features" well, if that is the case why are those features so limited? Canon is selling this camera as a jack of all trades and now we find out that the heat limits on that camera are not determined by the thermostat but by a timer? I do agree, people should not be doing this at home as it might indeed be dangerous, despite the fact that camera does have an actual thermostat with actual overheating protection, so there are 2 real theories as to what is going on, eather Canon is playing it safe and that is the safest way to use the camera for its longevity OR it is true that canon does not want you to have those features unless you dump money on the video camera... well im sorry but the competition offeres the same packedge without overheating, so why should i pick Canon then?

Easy Peasy. You are free to pick any camera you want. Just do it.

 

[GastonShutters]

Continue reading...

I am a photographer and I also own an electronic engineering Lab. I consulted with my engineers the R5 issue and they told me that you don’t need to heat up excessively to cause damage to certain electronics. While most electronics can run at high temperature with no problem some other components may fail at that temperature.

mine of them could be the sensor. You don’t have to get that high temperature hot to the touch but simply at the electronic component level. Air, metal and plastic actually helps disípate heat but does not prevent electronics from producing heat.

My R5 does heat up to the touch. Not an excessive heat but I’m assuming that internally some components get critically hot for a safe operation.

What I’m watching in this video is Russian roulette. If the camera has that sensor in the battery door compartment, there is a reason for it and tampering with it may hurt the camera and void warranty for sure. It’s like thinking that you won’t ever get a fire in your house because you removed the one detectors.

The R5 is a great Photo camera first. And by the way can shoot some kick as a videos. Some modes for a short period of time some others longer.

I suggest that people wanting ultra high res should consider cinema cameras and not photography cameras or an A7Siii that seemed to have nailed the formula of great video features in a mirrorless body.

 

[Whowe]

Did anyone notice that canon replaced the R5 Advanced User Guide with the original guide published about July 29 on the Canon USA Support Page? That was the version with numerous errors...

 

[Surab]

Actual cool down time is two minutes. In use the camera never exceeds 64C, which is well within the safety limits of the camera. To understand better it might help to know that Canon enables unlimited 4K HQ if recorded externally. I regularly run my R5 for hours at a time continuously outputting 4K HQ. The camera heats up to normal operating temperature of 64C and stays there the entire time. Please understand image quality remains consistent. There is no image degradation at these temps as some have suggested. And to make a point, this usage is approved by Canon, but strangely, running at the exact same temperature when recording internally... in the exact same mode, is somehow cause for a thermal feature lockout?
Worst still, in reality it only takes 2 minutes for the camera to cool back down to 30C. Literally, just 2 minutes... yet Canon disable these features for 2/hrs plus.
This is clearly deliberate and unfair to customers. The extremely long lockout times are mentioned nowhere in the R5 manual. There is no mention of this on the official website. To this day Canon have not spoken to this matter.

Key points:

• Unlimited recording is permissible at 64C if recording externally. But yet, at the exact same temperature, if recording internally you are artificially limited to 20 minutes.
• Actual internal cool down time is only two minutes. But Canon has chosen to disable all headline video features for 2/hrs plus. Despite the fact that the camera at no point ever reaches unsafe temperatures.

Thank you this was a well-written summary.

 

[Surab]

I am a photographer and I also own an electronic engineering Lab. I consulted with my engineers the R5 issue and they told me that you don’t need to heat up excessively to cause damage to certain electronics. While most electronics can run at high temperature with no problem some other components may fail at that temperature.

mine of them could be the sensor. You don’t have to get that high temperature hot to the touch but simply at the electronic component level. Air, metal and plastic actually helps disípate heat but does not prevent electronics from producing heat.

My R5 does heat up to the touch. Not an excessive heat but I’m assuming that internally some components get critically hot for a safe operation.

What I’m watching in this video is Russian roulette. If the camera has that sensor in the battery door compartment, there is a reason for it and tampering with it may hurt the camera and void warranty for sure. It’s like thinking that you won’t ever get a fire in your house because you removed the one detectors.

The R5 is a great Photo camera first. And by the way can shoot some kick as a videos. Some modes for a short period of time some others longer.

I suggest that people wanting ultra high res should consider cinema cameras and not photography cameras or an A7Siii that seemed to have nailed the formula of great video features in a mirrorless body.

But it's not about the short amount of time, but rather that if it's not the first thing you do with, you are locked out them for 0.5-2h. Also you are locked out of them for 0.5-2h.

 

[YuengLinger]

Actual cool down time is two minutes. In use the camera never exceeds 64C, which is well within the safety limits of the camera. To understand better it might help to know that Canon enables unlimited 4K HQ if recorded externally. I regularly run my R5 for hours at a time continuously outputting 4K HQ. The camera heats up to normal operating temperature of 64C and stays there the entire time. Please understand image quality remains consistent. There is no image degradation at these temps as some have suggested. And to make a point, this usage is approved by Canon, but strangely, running at the exact same temperature when recording internally... in the exact same mode, is somehow cause for a thermal feature lockout?
Worst still, in reality it only takes 2 minutes for the camera to cool back down to 30C. Literally, just 2 minutes... yet Canon disable these features for 2/hrs plus.
This is clearly deliberate and unfair to customers. The extremely long lockout times are mentioned nowhere in the R5 manual. There is no mention of this on the official website. To this day Canon have not spoken to this matter.

Key points:

• Unlimited recording is permissible at 64C if recording externally. But yet, at the exact same temperature, if recording internally you are artificially limited to 20 minutes.
• Actual internal cool down time is only two minutes. But Canon has chosen to disable all headline video features for 2/hrs plus. Despite the fact that the camera at no point ever reaches unsafe temperatures.

Where do you get the data saying that 64C "is well within the safety limits"? And what of the long term effects on various components?

 

[dtaylor]

I hate to say this, but this has boiled down to two groups. One group of people who are upset at the thermal limitations and are seeking understanding for a possible solution or hope of a solution from Canon. And another group of people attacking that first group for seemingly no reason other then they want to defend Canon and "their camera."

The R5 is arguably the best 35mm sensor stills camera available right now. If you only care about stills or are perfectly fine with line skipped 4k, then you love this camera. We get it. What the other side doesn't seem to get is that a lot of people want to love this camera, but find it's not a solution for them because of the severe thermal issues. People who have been waiting for a stellar hybrid option from Canon for years now. People who want to use Canon's new RF glass. People who do not want to buy a competitor's camera.

Continually attacking these people and their motives, making excuses for what is clearly a misstep on the part of Canon engineering and Canon marketing, and insisting everything is fine isn't doing Canon any favors. Everything is not fine. This absolutely affects sales and consumer perceptions. No, Canon is not doomed. But it's a pretty bad screw up none-the-less.

Keep in mind these issues affect the R6 as well. Limit the R5's video features and it's still a great stills camera which competes with cameras (A7r4, Z7) that don't have comparable video features any way. Limit the R6's video features and it's not that competitive of a camera at its current price point. It would need to drop $500-$750 and even then you'll have a lot of people who pick something else because they want 4k video any time, any place. Not temperature warnings because they shot some stills or played with a menu.

As for me personally: if Canon were to fix this with a firmware update then I would likely add an R5 within the next couple months. If not...hard pass. I'll wait to see if they release the rumored 83-100mp R next year. If I have to carry a separate camera for video any way then I might as well save my money for the resolution bump in stills.

And that separate camera for video? Looks like it's not going to be Canon. I hate to sacrifice FF and turn to 3rd party adapters, but the X-T3 is stupid cheap right now and it outputs 4k 24/30/60 that's just as good as the over sampled, HQ 4k in the R5 and R6. For the price of an R6 you can outfit an X-T3 with an EF adapter, gimbal, and Ninja. I've literally stuck with FHD and Magic Lantern 2.5k waiting for Canon's real R bodies. (Not to disrespect the R and RP, but they were clearly stop gap cameras.) Those R bodies have dropped and the thermal issues are just too much to deal with for serious video use. I want usable 4k, not excuses.

First world problems I know...but I'm not going to defend Canon on this one. They simply dropped the ball on a camera release that should have been a home run to win the series.

 

[YuengLinger]

I hate to say this, but this has boiled down to two groups. One group of people who are upset at the thermal limitations and are seeking understanding for a possible solution or hope of a solution from Canon. And another group of people attacking that first group for seemingly no reason other then they want to defend Canon and "their camera."

The R5 is arguably the best 35mm sensor stills camera available right now. If you only care about stills or are perfectly fine with line skipped 4k, then you love this camera. We get it. What the other side doesn't seem to get is that a lot of people want to love this camera, but find it's not a solution for them because of the severe thermal issues. People who have been waiting for a stellar hybrid option from Canon for years now. People who want to use Canon's new RF glass. People who do not want to buy a competitor's camera.

Continually attacking these people and their motives, making excuses for what is clearly a misstep on the part of Canon engineering and Canon marketing, and insisting everything is fine isn't doing Canon any favors. Everything is not fine. This absolutely affects sales and consumer perceptions. No, Canon is not doomed. But it's a pretty bad screw up none-the-less.

Keep in mind these issues affect the R6 as well. Limit the R5's video features and it's still a great stills camera which competes with cameras (A7r4, Z7) that don't have comparable video features any way. Limit the R6's video features and it's not that competitive of a camera at its current price point. It would need to drop $500-$750 and even then you'll have a lot of people who pick something else because they want 4k video any time, any place. Not temperature warnings because they shot some stills or played with a menu.

As for me personally: if Canon were to fix this with a firmware update then I would likely add an R5 within the next couple months. If not...hard pass. I'll wait to see if they release the rumored 83-100mp R next year. If I have to carry a separate camera for video any way then I might as well save my money for the resolution bump in stills.

And that separate camera for video? Looks like it's not going to be Canon. I hate to sacrifice FF and turn to 3rd party adapters, but the X-T3 is stupid cheap right now and it outputs 4k 24/30/60 that's just as good as the over sampled, HQ 4k in the R5 and R6. For the price of an R6 you can outfit an X-T3 with an EF adapter, gimbal, and Ninja. I've literally stuck with FHD and Magic Lantern 2.5k waiting for Canon's real R bodies. (Not to disrespect the R and RP, but they were clearly stop gap cameras.) Those R bodies have dropped and the thermal issues are just too much to deal with for serious video use. I want usable 4k, not excuses.

First world problems I know...but I'm not going to defend Canon on this one. They simply dropped the ball on a camera release that should have been a home run to win the series.

Several fine points, well said. But please don't forget there are antagonizing, unpleasant people posting here and elsewhere for their own reasons--not to help, but just to provoke and be unpleasant. It's not all one side ganging up on the other!

 

[masterpix]

Then why offer it in the r5? And why can’t I record 5 min clips in 8k for my enjoyment without having to buy a dedicated video camera ?

Smile, you just proved the point I was making (the camra is a stills camera that enable you for short videos - not a video camera), the R5 video capabilites is for 5 min clips, not long video recording (and for that it won't overheat). If you are for long videos then buy a video camera. The same for stils, if you are for stils, don't buy a video camera that enable stils. Take for instance the new Sony A7, which is a video oriented camera (and it is very good at if as far as I know) but its stils performances are not as high as one would expect from a camera at this time.

 

[masterpix]

I hate to say this, but this has boiled down to two groups. One group of people who are upset at the thermal limitations and are seeking understanding for a possible solution or hope of a solution from Canon. And another group of people attacking that first group for seemingly no reason other then they want to defend Canon and "their camera."

The R5 is arguably the best 35mm sensor stills camera available right now. If you only care about stills or are perfectly fine with line skipped 4k, then you love this camera. We get it. What the other side doesn't seem to get is that a lot of people want to love this camera, but find it's not a solution for them because of the severe thermal issues. People who have been waiting for a stellar hybrid option from Canon for years now. People who want to use Canon's new RF glass. People who do not want to buy a competitor's camera.

Continually attacking these people and their motives, making excuses for what is clearly a misstep on the part of Canon engineering and Canon marketing, and insisting everything is fine isn't doing Canon any favors. Everything is not fine. This absolutely affects sales and consumer perceptions. No, Canon is not doomed. But it's a pretty bad screw up none-the-less.

Keep in mind these issues affect the R6 as well. Limit the R5's video features and it's still a great stills camera which competes with cameras (A7r4, Z7) that don't have comparable video features any way. Limit the R6's video features and it's not that competitive of a camera at its current price point. It would need to drop $500-$750 and even then you'll have a lot of people who pick something else because they want 4k video any time, any place. Not temperature warnings because they shot some stills or played with a menu.

As for me personally: if Canon were to fix this with a firmware update then I would likely add an R5 within the next couple months. If not...hard pass. I'll wait to see if they release the rumored 83-100mp R next year. If I have to carry a separate camera for video any way then I might as well save my money for the resolution bump in stills.

And that separate camera for video? Looks like it's not going to be Canon. I hate to sacrifice FF and turn to 3rd party adapters, but the X-T3 is stupid cheap right now and it outputs 4k 24/30/60 that's just as good as the over sampled, HQ 4k in the R5 and R6. For the price of an R6 you can outfit an X-T3 with an EF adapter, gimbal, and Ninja. I've literally stuck with FHD and Magic Lantern 2.5k waiting for Canon's real R bodies. (Not to disrespect the R and RP, but they were clearly stop gap cameras.) Those R bodies have dropped and the thermal issues are just too much to deal with for serious video use. I want usable 4k, not excuses.

First world problems I know...but I'm not going to defend Canon on this one. They simply dropped the ball on a camera release that should have been a home run to win the series.

I think it is a matter of expecting something to be more than what it is. take the EOD 6D for example, people were upset with it not to be as versitile as the 5D when the 6D was never intended to be the 5D. The R5/R6 are stills cameras that allows short video clips. It is not a video camera taht allows stills shooting. It is therfore a compermize on the video performances (the over-heating issue). As for the AF, eye tracking and sensor size, those are superb.

For myself, if the R5 had a OVF (and it seems that then it will be 5Dmark5), than I would brake my savings and get one, for I only shoot stills, and having a "mechanical" 16fps and eye/body tracking... that wold make this picture a lot better than what I got from my 7D.

 

[BeenThere]

I hate to say this, but this has boiled down to two groups. One group of people who are upset at the thermal limitations and are seeking understanding for a possible solution or hope of a solution from Canon. And another group of people attacking that first group for seemingly no reason other then they want to defend Canon and "their camera."

The R5 is arguably the best 35mm sensor stills camera available right now. If you only care about stills or are perfectly fine with line skipped 4k, then you love this camera. We get it. What the other side doesn't seem to get is that a lot of people want to love this camera, but find it's not a solution for them because of the severe thermal issues. People who have been waiting for a stellar hybrid option from Canon for years now. People who want to use Canon's new RF glass. People who do not want to buy a competitor's camera.

Continually attacking these people and their motives, making excuses for what is clearly a misstep on the part of Canon engineering and Canon marketing, and insisting everything is fine isn't doing Canon any favors. Everything is not fine. This absolutely affects sales and consumer perceptions. No, Canon is not doomed. But it's a pretty bad screw up none-the-less.

Keep in mind these issues affect the R6 as well. Limit the R5's video features and it's still a great stills camera which competes with cameras (A7r4, Z7) that don't have comparable video features any way. Limit the R6's video features and it's not that competitive of a camera at its current price point. It would need to drop $500-$750 and even then you'll have a lot of people who pick something else because they want 4k video any time, any place. Not temperature warnings because they shot some stills or played with a menu.

As for me personally: if Canon were to fix this with a firmware update then I would likely add an R5 within the next couple months. If not...hard pass. I'll wait to see if they release the rumored 83-100mp R next year. If I have to carry a separate camera for video any way then I might as well save my money for the resolution bump in stills.

And that separate camera for video? Looks like it's not going to be Canon. I hate to sacrifice FF and turn to 3rd party adapters, but the X-T3 is stupid cheap right now and it outputs 4k 24/30/60 that's just as good as the over sampled, HQ 4k in the R5 and R6. For the price of an R6 you can outfit an X-T3 with an EF adapter, gimbal, and Ninja. I've literally stuck with FHD and Magic Lantern 2.5k waiting for Canon's real R bodies. (Not to disrespect the R and RP, but they were clearly stop gap cameras.) Those R bodies have dropped and the thermal issues are just too much to deal with for serious video use. I want usable 4k, not excuses.

First world problems I know...but I'm not going to defend Canon on this one. They simply dropped the ball on a camera release that should have been a home run to win the series.

What you seem to be saying is that you are disappointed and upset with Canon for not fulfilling your hopes and dreams with their latest Camera release. This is further complicated by all the pseudo testing by various people attempting to understand exactly what is creating the Camera’s response to lengthy video in the high def modes (heating, timer, whatever). So, it is natural to hope that some of these limitations are artificial and may be remediated in a future firmware release. It seems unlikely to me that any firmware tweaks are ever going to make the videocentric photographers (and pundits) happy with this camera. If you are waiting for that to happen, give it some time, but it is probably not going to do it for you. It is time to move on and start working on plan B, whatever that is for you. Eventually, Canon may give you what you are looking for in a future body, but that could be years. Would you be able to wait that long? We all have to work with what is and not what we wish it to be. If you feel that you have to punish Canon for disappointing you then I guess that badmouthing on this forum is one way to do that.

 

[TracerHD]

[...] The R5/R6 are stills cameras that allows short video clips. It is not a video camera taht allows stills shooting. It is therfore a compermize on the video performances (the over-heating issue). [...]

Then the "short video clips" would be arround 5min per take it would be ok, but the fact that shooting stills decreases the recording time makes the things more complicated. For me I'm ok with less record time, when taking photos will not decrese the video time. So I could be sure after shooting 1 or 2 hours of stills still be able to do 4k120p 5min.

If shooting stills wouldn't affect the recording times, my use-cases for the features would be:
8K for stills there I expect that 30fps will deliver "that" shot I need, and 35MP are enough.
4k120fps for short moments, I would not film 5min to get the small sequence I need to slow down 4 times, that would be 10 - 20sec start recording before and 10sec after that.
4k60fps for things there 60fps looks better.
4K30fps HQ for that sequenzes and short clips that "need" the extra quality.
and the normal stuff would be filmed with 4k30fps normal / low quality.

That's what I guess. If there would be a client who want all time high quality, best of the best, I would try an external recorder or rent a cinema camera for that time.

 

[David_E]

This is probably analogous to driving an automobile with no coolant in the radiator.

4k and 8k video are a marketing scam. If you want to fall for that scam, buy a video camera.

A couple of days ago I shot eight hours of continuous video in 1080p with my R5 sitting in the sun in 90+F degrees of heat, pausing only to restart the video every 30 minutes and to change batteries. It performed flawlessly. A 90-second clip from the stream may be seen at https://vimeo.com/449804025.