What's Next From Canon?
- Thread starter Canon Rumors
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3kramd5 said:
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I am guessing THEY have something to do with ACTUAL imaging sensor and/or CPU/GPU/DSP work done on the specific products I am reporting on! ...OR...they know or have DIRECT contact with the people doing the actual work for Canon, Sony, Panasonic, etc. Every indication I get from these sources leads me to believe thay have at least SPECIFIC knowledge of what's coming down the pipeline AND they have the deep electrical engineering knowledge to tell me and comment on when OTHER reports from OTHER SOURCES are utter bilge or not!
Again! They have been reliable in the past AND I simply cannot ignore people who have actually DESIGNED the base hardware and electrical portions of products some of you use every day! While I don't have ANY specific personal details since they HAVE ENSURED that they are anonymous to me, I have done enough diligence to know that their opinions and statements CANNOT BE EASILY DISCOUNTED !!!
Ergo, I believe my earlier forum posts TO BE CORRECT and A LIKELY TRUE LIST OF what camera products are coming down the pipeline from Canon in the very near future !!!
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transpo1 said:
They haven't shaken anything up yet. Certainly the EOS M line shows that Canon can be very competitive in the MILC segment. Regarding FF MILCs, consider that the major source of those buyers for Canon will be current Canon APS-C owners.
Sorry it's hard for you to believe it. Last year, Sony did a press release to announce that they were #2 in FF ILC sales in the US for a two month period. Nikon then announced they were #1 in FF ILC sales in the US...for one month. Who do you think was #1 for the other 11 months? Don't you think, given that Sony formally announced they were #2 for a brief shining moment, that if they actually managed to take significant market share from Canon they'd shout it from Mt. Fuji?
If it makes you feel better, I'll readily concede that Sony totally dominates the FF mirrorless segment.
They also have a solid lead in the global MILC market (but their latest internally-generated projections have them losing market share).
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neuroanatomist said:transpo1 said:
They haven't shaken anything up yet. Certainly the EOS M line shows that Canon can be very competitive in the MILC segment. Regarding FF MILCs, consider that the major source of those buyers for Canon will be current Canon APS-C owners.
Sorry it's hard for you to believe it. Last year, Sony did a press release to announce that they were #2 in FF ILC sales in the US for a two month period. Nikon then announced they were #1 in FF ILC sales in the US...for one month. Who do you think was #1 for the other 11 months? Don't you think, given that Sony formally announced they were #2 for a brief shining moment, that if they actually managed to take significant market share from Canon they'd shout it from Mt. Fuji?
If it makes you feel better, I'll readily concede that Sony totally dominates the FF mirrorless segment.
No, of course Canon have not shaken anything up yet, or in a long time. But, judging by these rumors (if they are true), they will. And as any good businessman or woman knows- disrupting yourself is the key to longevity of sales; disrupt yourself before someone else does. And if these rumors are true, Canon knows this- and have learned it recently with the buzz surrounding MILC products from competitors. I’m totally agnostic when it comes to brands, so it doesn’t matter to me who wins, except that I do own a lot of Canon glass which is why I would like them to compete in this MILC hybrid/video arena and disrupt themselves before others do.
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As a general outline in terms of how to BACK-UP the veracity of my statements, I do confess that I am a man of science and TRY to apply the Scientific Method to technology reporting. I first observe if my source (or multiple sources!) have substantiative data that is consistent with known scientific/engineering principles and/or known technology. Then I determine if OTHER sources have coincidental information that meshes with said initial source. After that, I determine the CREDENTIALS and/or experience of the source to see if they actually have a technical basis to make a claim.
Finally, I perform "An Experiment" to be replicated across multiple sources that is structured in a way to see if the TECHNICAL UNDERPINNING of what is stated is indeed consistent with my first source. For example, I know that "Sony Guy" has told me that 100,000 2/3rds inch sensor chips were ordered to be shipped to a warehouse via rail to Chengdu, China AND I find out from "Foxconn Girl" that their Still Camera manufacturing plant in Chengdu is receiving 100,000+ Sony Exmor chips via rail next week, AND I find out from "Lens Guy Korea" that 100,000 2/3rds inch kit lenses with a Sony logo on them are being shipped to a warehouse in Chengdu, I can reasonably make a connection that a New Camera from Sony is coming out in X-number of weeks/months.
From there I will ask Singapore Finance Girl what their Freight On-Board list is in terms of 100,000 piece containers is like. If she tells me in June that eight 40 ft containers worth of 100,000 Sony items is going to Los Angeles...SO...I can see all the connections indicating that in September (4 to 6-week marine shipping schedule) a 2/3rd inch kit-lenses camera setup is likely to me introduced for sale after Photokina from Sony!
Same with Canon !!! If I find out that 400,000 180mm , 160mm and 140mm diameter 1200 mm long aluminum or magnesium tubes from Taiwan have been shipped to the Osaka Canon lens factory, I can reasonably say that a VERY LARGE BARREL FORMAT LENS is being produced. If I also see an order for 20000 litres of flourine (for flourite glass) are also being shipped the same week it means the flourite order indicates an L-series lens and an Indium Oxide order indicates a very specialized coating AND if I see magnesium sheet rolls of 1/32nds inch thick i coming from a factory on Hokkaido AND that multiple cobalt steel stamp/mold forms are coming Toshiba metalworks that is 250mm by 200mm by 150mm THAT indicates a LARGE CAMERA BODY is being stamped out ....SOOOO....ergo, a medium format camera and lens system is a LIKELY possibility!
It's all about connecting the dots. Soooo while my sources are anonymous, they ARE mostly engineers and finance people....WHICH ALLOWS ME... to make multiple connections to give me a reasonable outline of what is coming down the pipeline AND WHEN! My sheer experience in large systems development gives me the expertise to make reasonable estimates on raw materials usage and shipping times so I can then MAKE A VERY REASONABLE GUESS as to who is making what, at where, and then find out when they will deliver! SOOOOOO......I believe that Canon will have a mirrorless APS-C and/or Full Frame M5-look-alike AND/OR a XC-15-like one-inch sensor, combined ILC video/stills camera announcement at or just before Photokina 2018! AND....I believe that February/March 2019 will have Canon making an announcement on a Medium Format Large Sensor camera!
So there YOU HAVE IT !!!!
REMEMBER! YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!!!!!!!!
Finally, I perform "An Experiment" to be replicated across multiple sources that is structured in a way to see if the TECHNICAL UNDERPINNING of what is stated is indeed consistent with my first source. For example, I know that "Sony Guy" has told me that 100,000 2/3rds inch sensor chips were ordered to be shipped to a warehouse via rail to Chengdu, China AND I find out from "Foxconn Girl" that their Still Camera manufacturing plant in Chengdu is receiving 100,000+ Sony Exmor chips via rail next week, AND I find out from "Lens Guy Korea" that 100,000 2/3rds inch kit lenses with a Sony logo on them are being shipped to a warehouse in Chengdu, I can reasonably make a connection that a New Camera from Sony is coming out in X-number of weeks/months.
From there I will ask Singapore Finance Girl what their Freight On-Board list is in terms of 100,000 piece containers is like. If she tells me in June that eight 40 ft containers worth of 100,000 Sony items is going to Los Angeles...SO...I can see all the connections indicating that in September (4 to 6-week marine shipping schedule) a 2/3rd inch kit-lenses camera setup is likely to me introduced for sale after Photokina from Sony!
Same with Canon !!! If I find out that 400,000 180mm , 160mm and 140mm diameter 1200 mm long aluminum or magnesium tubes from Taiwan have been shipped to the Osaka Canon lens factory, I can reasonably say that a VERY LARGE BARREL FORMAT LENS is being produced. If I also see an order for 20000 litres of flourine (for flourite glass) are also being shipped the same week it means the flourite order indicates an L-series lens and an Indium Oxide order indicates a very specialized coating AND if I see magnesium sheet rolls of 1/32nds inch thick i coming from a factory on Hokkaido AND that multiple cobalt steel stamp/mold forms are coming Toshiba metalworks that is 250mm by 200mm by 150mm THAT indicates a LARGE CAMERA BODY is being stamped out ....SOOOO....ergo, a medium format camera and lens system is a LIKELY possibility!
It's all about connecting the dots. Soooo while my sources are anonymous, they ARE mostly engineers and finance people....WHICH ALLOWS ME... to make multiple connections to give me a reasonable outline of what is coming down the pipeline AND WHEN! My sheer experience in large systems development gives me the expertise to make reasonable estimates on raw materials usage and shipping times so I can then MAKE A VERY REASONABLE GUESS as to who is making what, at where, and then find out when they will deliver! SOOOOOO......I believe that Canon will have a mirrorless APS-C and/or Full Frame M5-look-alike AND/OR a XC-15-like one-inch sensor, combined ILC video/stills camera announcement at or just before Photokina 2018! AND....I believe that February/March 2019 will have Canon making an announcement on a Medium Format Large Sensor camera!
So there YOU HAVE IT !!!!
REMEMBER! YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!!!!!!!!
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neuroanatomist said:If it makes you feel better, I'll readily concede that Sony totally dominates the FF mirrorless segment.
Do they? I think Leica SL sales are highly underreported. I'm told that authoritarian regimes use the SL + 90-280 combo as a cudgel to put down riots. ;D
- A
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I'm not convinced that it would be profitable for Canon (I'm not convinced that it is profitable for Sony either, apart from probably being a part of their marketing campaign for their definitely profitable image sensors business). What's worse to me, I'm not convinced that it won't distract Canon's engineers from something I would consider more interesting than the current "state of the art" MILC.ahsanford said:
The next mirrorless camera I'm waiting for is G7X Mark III. My S100 needs replacing, which also means its underwater housing needs replacing. My current housing survived two S100s, so I'm not going to buy one that is going to be obsolete in several months.
What I personally want from my next (and first) MILC is global shutter and a round sensor for FF lens image circle. Which at the moment would be too expensive for me.
What I want from my next short-flange mount MILC is removal of microlenses and their replacement with more short-flange-friendly technology (DO or whatever). Which at the moment just doesn't exist.
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HarryFilm said:
So what you are saying is that no-one knows what Canon are doing with their upcoming mirrorless camera - but one thing that is certain is that it will have a sensor of one size or another
That they are making a medium format camera with a data throughput that smacks the 1Dx2 into the long grass. Despite there not being a single rumour elsewhere that I can find
And despite the tech industry being a hotbed of rumours and investments, you are the only one in the world giving credence on the internet to stories of a takeover. or is it a joint venture? Or have they agreed to swap Christmas cards? You were saying only a few short weeks ago it was a takeover, and now you don't know.
So when you say your sources have been 'rather reliable' for you in the past, what you really mean is that they are acting than little more than a rumour site.
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Mikehit said:
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The Medium Format camera has been in testing for quite a long time - I've seen the photos of it from Germany! It looks like stretched-out 1Dx Mk2 in the vertical and horizontal and quite-a-bit THICKER front to back! It has a HUGE mount getting pretty close to the size of the very large format Alexa-65 video camera mount.
The Mirrorless M5-look-alike is a bit more nebulous in specs but the number of statements made by engineering and finance indicates a short flange and 4:2:2 10 bits stills/video. Based upon what I see in my rumour mill arena, I am erring on the side that it will be an APS-C sensor rather than a full frame camera.
The Apple/Canon thing is from finance types who say there are activist shareholders in Apple who are pressuring the Apple board to spend some money in ways OTHER THAN a share buyback so as to get the market excited allowing the Apple stock price to rise.
The TWO names that consistently pop up are Canon and Texas Instruments and from a TECHNOLOGY point of view, they BOTH make sense for Apple to buy, especially since BOTH Canon and TI have chip building technology allowing Apple to bring RAM/CPU/GPU chip production entirely in-house! Canon would cost Apple about $55 Billion US and Texas Instruments could be had for $25 Billion US! The technology side rumors have LATELY been saying that Apple wants to buy large sensors from Canon for a new Large Sensor Smartphone while OTHER rumor mill engineers are saying it is Canon that wants to bring out the large image sensor smartphone. At this point I have to step back and say that a new large sensor smartphone IS COMING but what logo it will have i still don't know with any certainty! But what I AM certain of is that the image sensor will be AT LEAST a one-inch sensor maybe even APS-C size !!!
I do have though an almost ironclad proof that Apple and Canon executives HAVE been talking at very high levels for SOME type of agreement! (I won't mention what that is though because of the source's sensitive position!) Are those talks regarding a complete buyout/takeover OR is it a joint venture meetup to merely exchange patents? Based upon my finance-type sources, I am saying that the talks are about a COMPLETE PURCHASE of Canon by Apple rather than just a joint venture/patent exchange agreement!
My sources also predicted a Global Shutter C700 and they NAILED it's feature set dead-on! They also nailed the fact that the C500 would be left as is and 4K video would come to the C300 Mk2 instead. They are saying now on the video side that DCI 8K (8192x4380 pixels) 60 fps Global Shutter video is coming to a C300/C500 Cinema EOS body style at its current S35 sensor-style/size AND the C700 will receive an 8K Full Frame Global Shutter sensor at NAB 2019!
They also predicted the XC-10/XC-15 video cameras and I suspect they are PROBABLY CORRECT on the coming update which is to be interchangeable lens with 4:2:2 10-bit 60 fps codec on a one inch 4K video sensor and 20 megapixels for stills! This MAY be announced at Photokina 2018
Now of course, all we can do is WAIT until Photokina and NAB 2019 !!!!
or until Apple and Canon make a joint announcement (or NOT!)
Anyways, you ARE ALLOWED to take my statements with a grain or a million of salt!
BUT....WE SHALL SEE !!!!!
AGAIN! YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!!!!!!
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HarryFilm said:
So it is not even a rumour about Canon, but a rumour that 'activist shareholders' (who are arguably the most dangerous of the bunch) are pressuring Apple to spend money. The best way to apply pressure is to make it public! But no-one has.
Jeez.
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HarryFilm said:
Again: Next. level. paint. is being huffed in dangerous quantities here.
The reality Harry lives in has got to be amazing. Like an alternate universe where Freaks and Geeks and Firefly didn't get cancelled in their first seasons. Like a place where drywall tastes delicious and there is a Professional Hugging League that overtakes soccer as the world's #1 sport. Like a place where we're on the EF 50 f/1.4 IS USM IV by now.
- A
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unfocused said:
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BECAUSE I CAN"T TALK ABOUT IT !!!! GET IT !!!!
When YOU design and code a 4:4:4/4:2:2/4:1:1/4:2:0 High-Frame-Rate up-to-16-bits per colour channel Codec with multichannel audio, video and metadata streaming capability and is platform-independent AND THEN sell it to a large corporation...THEN YOU CAN ASK WHAT'S UP -- Otherwise (*^$*#&^*&$*&!@&*$($(*!@$&* !!!!!!
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ahsanford said:HarryFilm said:
Again: Next. level. paint. is being huffed in dangerous quantities here.
The reality Harry lives in has got to be amazing. Like an alternate universe where Freaks and Geeks and Firefly didn't get cancelled in their first seasons. Like a place where drywall tastes delicious and there is a Professional Hugging League that overtakes soccer as the world's #1 sport. Like a place where we're on the EF 50 f/1.4 IS USM IV by now.
- A
You had to bring up Firefly.
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These are the Media Merger Headlines in the last two days:
"Judge Approves $85 Billion AT&T and Time Warner Merger!"
"Comcast Bids $65 Billion for 21st Century Fox"
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The AT&T Anti-trust court case decision allowing the deal to go ahead NOW means large media conglomerates will be able to merge without fear of excessive anti-trust oversight and review delays.
The NEXT Deals that are in the Works within the Coming Weeks and Months:
"Apple Buys Canon for $55 Billion" ...OR... "Apple Buys Texas Instruments for $25 Billion"
"Sony and Microsoft in $20 Billion Joint Venture Agreement"
"Disney Buys Microsoft X-Box Division for $8 Billion"
"Sony/Microsoft Buys Sigma for $5 Billion"
"Nikon and Fujifilm Merge in $15 Billion Deal"
"Bertelsmann and Facebook Merger Creates USA/Euro Media Giant"
"Viacom and Walt Disney in Talks to Merge"
REMEMBER !!! YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!!!!!!!!!
"Judge Approves $85 Billion AT&T and Time Warner Merger!"
"Comcast Bids $65 Billion for 21st Century Fox"
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The AT&T Anti-trust court case decision allowing the deal to go ahead NOW means large media conglomerates will be able to merge without fear of excessive anti-trust oversight and review delays.
The NEXT Deals that are in the Works within the Coming Weeks and Months:
"Apple Buys Canon for $55 Billion" ...OR... "Apple Buys Texas Instruments for $25 Billion"
"Sony and Microsoft in $20 Billion Joint Venture Agreement"
"Disney Buys Microsoft X-Box Division for $8 Billion"
"Sony/Microsoft Buys Sigma for $5 Billion"
"Nikon and Fujifilm Merge in $15 Billion Deal"
"Bertelsmann and Facebook Merger Creates USA/Euro Media Giant"
"Viacom and Walt Disney in Talks to Merge"
REMEMBER !!! YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!!!!!!!!!
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