Canon EOS R1 Spotted in the wild at the Monaco GP

[SwissFrank]

The 1-series camera has always been about high-speed photography so I am not surprised at Canon's decision.

In the 90s the speed king wasn't the 1, it was the RT. In the 00s I shot with 1Ds and it wasn't the speed king either. Sure, the 1D existed too! Just saying the 1 has been more about being a rugged press/agency camera, SOMETIMES fast but SOMETIMES highest possible resolution.

 

[SwissFrank]

36MP sure. but 30? no.. simply because no lens is absolutely perfect and while you will get a resolution bump from 24 to 30, you don't get ALL of it unless you have an absolutely perfect lens that outresolves the entire sensor.

I don't disagree with anything you wrote but just wanted to note in my tests of camera hand-holding on the R5, the resolution is just fantastic. Even the 24-105/4 can resolve 2-pixel-wide lines at 45MP at quite high contrast... and that's over 50lp/mm. And it's the worst lens RF I've tested! The better ones are, like, FULL CONTRAST at 50lp/mm it seems, at least near the center. (And frankly when we think we're artistically putting subjects "off center", they're still pretty close to center in terms of an MTF chart. For instance putting a subject 1/3 of the way to the left, following the 1/3 rule, still is only 6mm off-center, while the MTF goes to 22mm, which is the very, very very corner...) So anyway, I think the current RF lenses are ready for 90MP or even 180MP. Won't be full-contrast of course but you will get usable detail I'm certain. On EF the 135/2 was by far the sharpest lens I had when it came out, but ALL RF lenses are sharper than that now it seems. I think it's under-appreciated how fantastic the glass is now.

 

[alanphotography]

Absolutely, the L RF lens outresolve R5 sensor, I believe this is well established. The argument that this is a reason for keeping the 1 series sensor definition does not hold water.

The fundamentals of resolution are simple are simple, frankly, as long as you only consider resolution. Sensor should always be outresolving the lens, because you don't want the other way around and loose info. One is limited by the lens they carry, that lens has a max resolution (in the center likely), so you want the sensor to get the max details so it needs out outresolve the peak (center) definition. Simply because you would want to extra all the definition from the lens you carry around, not loose some.

The many problem problems with high definition sensor (manufacturing defects/cost, speed, heat, storage, etc etc ...) are the reason why a low MP is favored in some cases, mainly when speed or marketing is in sight. But resolution is a simple debate, out of context, capturing more is just better.

Personally I will go for the R5 mk2 over a lower-MP 1 series. I made the same choice going for 5D4 instead of 1DX2, and while I regretted the fps drop (12>7fps) from my 1DX1 and not-as-confortable viewfinder, I really enjoy the 5D4 definition increase.

What I like most in those R1 images is a large EVF. With my glasses, a super large EVF would be lovely, I still find the R3 one too tiny for my taste.

 

[lnz]

That\'s a R3 Mark II, for me that confirm R3 was suppose to be the R1 and Z9 and A1 kills that release

 

[Richard CN]

That\'s a R3 Mark II, for me that confirm R3 was suppose to be the R1 and Z9 and A1 kills that release

it's a good theory, except for the fact that the R1 would have started its prototyping and development around 2020-21. According to Canon, it takes them around 3 or so years to develop the 1 series bodies.

 

[DhlcadR6]

I don’t buy into the conspiracy of R3 is the original R1. Canon never let the 1 series falls out of their 4-year schedule, 1DX3 was out in 2020 as schedule. R5 R6 is rushed to retain EF users onto RF, and R3 was a stopgap. It looks like Canon losing face when compared to Z9 a1, but that’s what SonNikon fanbois say all the time.

R3 is a platform Canon test on to make sure they have the fastest camera to trigger Sony. And it worked.

I still can’t believe R1 will be 24MP as they have to put 8k in.

 

[frankchn]

Sony's professional video camera segment is huge - they have around a 50% of the professional video camera market in terms of share. Canon's isn't, and "cameras" in Canon's financials are just that, video I believe is in the 'and others", as when they talk about the camera segment, it's purely cameras and doesn't include the professional video.

Fair, I am not sure how exactly the segments are split -- they are not very clear on that.

That said, if you add in 50% of all "Network camera and others" revenue back in to account for cine camera and lens revenues, then you are at 690.8 Billion JPY for Canon vs 643.4 Billion JPY for Sony. About 7% ahead of Sony, which is significant, but I won't call it a dominating performance.

I don't think it would be above 50% because in that case "network camera and others" segment would be renamed "video camera and others" to account for the majority of revenues in that segment coming from those products.

 

[DhlcadR6]

From my respective/conspiracy , A1 was the original a9iii, but Sony changed it to a1 just to up hand R5. A1 use the same marketing tricks but with higher MP so there’s few that against it. And Sony played themselves out, with Z9 Z8 being so cheap in comparison, Sony have to bring a9iii to keep their superiority complex going.

(If you ever reads SAR comments, 90% of them will be mad as Homelander if you said certain products from Sony is inferior to competitors,or speaking the truth of $ony caveats

 

[frankchn]

I still can’t believe R1 will be 24MP as they have to put 8k in.

I am not sure 8K is important to that segment of sports photographers and photojournalists. It seems like if you want to shoot 8K, Canon would rather sell you a R5C (and I assume eventually an R5C II).

 

[john1970]

it's a good theory, except for the fact that the R1 would have started its prototyping and development around 2020-21. According to Canon, it takes them around 3 or so years to develop the 1 series bodies.

Thank you for using rational facts to disprove the rumors that the R3 was meant to be a R1. As someone that solely uses the R3 cameras the R1 is an amazing upgrade for only $500 over R3's original list price.

For me the key upgrades are:

• Quad pixel AF
• 2 ms readout speed (R3 is 5.5 ms)
• 6K RAW video at 120 fps Will we get 4K at 240 fps???
• Dual CF Express Type B v4 slots.
• 16 bit mechanical / 14 bit electronic shutter, which implies the camera still retains a mechanical shutter, nice.

 

[john1970]

I am not sure 8K is important to that segment of sports photographers and photojournalists. It seems like if you want to shoot 8K, Canon would rather sell you a R5C (and I assume eventually an R5C II).

Or a soon to be released R5 Mk2, which I am sure does 8K video.

 

[frankchn]

From my respective/conspiracy , A1 was the original a9iii, but Sony changed it to a1 just to up hand R5. A1 use the same marketing tricks but with higher MP so there’s few that against it. And Sony played themselves out, with Z9 Z8 being so cheap in comparison, Sony have to bring a9iii to keep their superiority complex going.

From a market segmentation purpose, it makes sense for Sony. A1 is the camera that is the "do everything" camera, and A9 is the camera that is dedicated to sports photographers and people who really want very high speed cameras. I would recommend an A1 to a landscape photographer as well as a sports shooter, but not the A9 or R3 for instance (mainly because MP count is low).

Same reason why I don't think the R1 will get a big bump in resolution over the 1DX Mark III and R3. Making a camera that fast would come with other compromises (fps mainly) and Canon has always positioned the 1 series cameras since the 1DX as the speed demon instead of the "do it all" camera. I don't see Canon changing that strategy, and changing it will alienate some of their existing market.

As an aside, maybe Sony's camera division won't be happy with the Z8/9, but Sony as a whole might not mind too much. The sensor from the Z8/9 is from Sony semiconductors after all.

 

[john1970]

It is interesting that Sony as well as Canon differentiates their top cameras (A1 vs. A9) and (R1 vs. R5) with different resolution while the Nikon Z9 and Z8 have the same resolution. I am not bashing any manufacturer, but just pointing out the obvious.

For me the R5 Mk2 is the perfect macro and landscape camera and the R1 is a perfect camera for low-light high speed photography where one does not required significant crops or make large prints.

 

[frankchn]

Thank you for using rational facts to disprove the rumors that the R3 was meant to be a R1. As someone that solely uses the R3 cameras the R1 is an amazing upgrade for only $500 over R3's original list price.

I think the question whether the R3 is meant to be an R1 is sort of irrelevant anyway. At launch, the R3 is priced ($6k) right between the two other flagships: Z9 ($5.5k) and A1 ($6.5k). It is sort of inevitable that the R3 will be treated like a flagship and compared to the other two cameras, whether Canon brands it as an R1, R3, R1000, or whatever.

I think if Canon launched the R3 at its current price ($4.5k), we won't even be having this conversation.

 

[sanj]

When is the camera approximately slated for release? Does anyone know? Thx

 

[Canon Rumors]

When is the camera approximately slated for release? Does anyone know? Thx

It won't be shipping until November at the earliest. I don't expect the official announcement until Late August/Early September so retailers aren't dealing with "where's my camera?" for longer than necessary. The first batch of cameras will likely go to CPS and Ambassadors, with retailers 3rd on pecking order.

 

[john1970]

I think the question whether the R3 is meant to be an R1 is sort of irrelevant anyway. At launch, the R3 is priced ($6k) right between the two other flagships: Z9 ($5.5k) and A1 ($6.5k). It is sort of inevitable that the R3 will be treated like a flagship and compared to the other two cameras, whether Canon brands it as an R1, R3, R1000, or whatever.

I think if Canon launched the R3 at its current price ($4.5k), we won't even be having this conversation.

I agree that the R3 was pricey at $6K launch price, but I never considered it a flagship. For me, it was a EOS R equivalent to the EOS-3 camera and a predecessor to a flagship camera (i.e., the R1).

 

[Canon Rumors]

I don’t buy into the conspiracy of R3 is the original R1. Canon never let the 1 series falls out of their 4-year schedule, 1DX3 was out in 2020 as schedule. R5 R6 is rushed to retain EF users onto RF, and R3 was a stopgap. It looks like Canon losing face when compared to Z9 a1, but that’s what SonNikon fanbois say all the time.

R3 is a platform Canon test on to make sure they have the fastest camera to trigger Sony. And it worked.

I still can’t believe R1 will be 24MP as they have to put 8k in.

Canon has 2 8K cameras, the R5/R5 C. People would likely prefer the smaller form factor of those two cameras, and whatever else comes. I suspect 8K will be makings way to other areas of the Cinema EOS lineup. With the EOS R5 Mark II getting a battery cooling grip, it's probably going to be more capable anyway.

I mean, 6K just fine. 8K is still a "look what we can do". There really isn't a lot of 8K out there.

 

[neuroanatomist]

That\'s a R3 Mark II, for me that confirm R3 was suppose to be the R1 and Z9 and A1 kills that release

Let me get this straight. Canon was developing a 24 MP, integrated grip camera in 2000 and planning to launch it as the R1. Then, when they saw Sony and Nikon’s higher MP cameras, Canon panicked and renamed that 24 MP camera the R3, because they knew it couldn’t compete as the R1.

They immediately started developing a new camera as the replacement R1, and now it’s finally ready to compete with Sony and Nikon…and it has, wait for it, a 24 MP sensor.

Seriously, is cogitation really that hard?

 

[Quarkcharmed]

It takes time to select and downscale images - time you may not have.

You'll have to select them regardless of the resolution and file size. Then in camera you can have different jpeg resolutions, or you can convert jpegs on your device, or with whatever app does the transfer. Even CameraConnect allows different jpeg sizes on import.

With a 24 MP camera you can automatically transfer or FTP images as they are being shot from multiple cameras.

If you need a reduced size, shoot reduced size jpegs, or reduced jpeg+raw.

Again slow file transfer in complex environments is not the reason Canon goes 24Mp.